Streamlined equipment on the K.C. - Florida Special?

Pool sleepers were cars that were used by certain railroads during certain seasons and other railroads during other seasons. For example, the ACL and SAL needed extra cars in the wintertime for their New York-Florida trains, whereas (say) the Great Northern needed more cars during the summer months for tourists traveling to Glacier Park (which would be pretty inhospitable during the winter). Illinois Central would "borrow" Northern Pacific domes for use in the CITY OF MIAMI, which only ran in the winter months. They went so far as to repaint the cars into IC colors, because they were fussy about how their trains looked. 6-6-4 cars tended to wind up in pool service because they contained open sections which were somewhat less popular, so in periods of low demand on the UP, they were more or less surplus and could be leased out to other carriers.

GS

 

Just to expand on what Greg said, most sleeping cars were leased to Pullman (after 1948 ) so the Pullman company assigned where the cars were used. Technically all of the cars leased to or owned by Pullman were part of the Pullman pool, with some cars assigned to trains. Cars not assigned to trains were used to cover both seasonal traffic and special movements.

Paul

 

The Frisco had but two tunnels on the Central Divison; Winslow, AR & Jensen, OK .
Conditional stops are those places where the train will stop when flagged, or when some other condition is met. For example 105 would stop at Paola, KS to take on passengers for Springfield or beyond. They are noted in the timetable with a letter by the departure time.

Rogersville is not listed in the timetable, so The Sunnyland did not have a scheduled stop of any kind. I am really surprised that the train stopped and backed-up to pick-up your mom. I wonder what the conductor said when he found out that she was only going to Springfield

Ed was a very intersting fellow to speak with. You are right; he lived on the south side of Springfield in the vincity of Seminole and Luster(?).


This is the earliest PTT, Aug 1960, (in my possession) that when refering to the KC-FS, uses the phrase "regularly assigned cars are lightweight and streamlined". The phrase leaves ample wiggle room for variations in trains consists. The heavy weight Pullmans have been set aside, and all the Pullman routes, STL-OKC, STL-Tulsa, STL-Ft Smith, & KC-Jacksonville, are served by the Frisco lightweight 14-4 cars.

 

Does anyone out there know when the Southeastern Limited (train #5, southbound) and Kansas City Limited (train #6, northbound) were reinvented as the Kansas City Florida Special?

Thanks,
John Sanders

 

ETT 100 is very nice. I believe that Oct or Nov 1899 mark the date of the inaugural runs of 5 & 6. The KC-FS replaced 5 & 6 on November 26, 1911.

 

There actually seems to have been a 5 & 6 prior to 1899. System ETT 7 (Apr 1898) shows 5 as the (westbound) Texas and California Limited (St. Louis to Monett) which continued (still 5) as the Texas Limited down the "main line" to Paris, TX. No. 6 was the (eastbound) St. Louis Limited (Paris, TX to St. Louis).

 

I located a public timetable from September, 1903. There appears to be an intermediate step between KCFtS&M trains 5 and 6 and Frisco Lines trains. The Southeastern Limited NB was numbered 206 and SB 105.

Thanks for the help guys.
John Sanders

 

In the context of this thread, The KC Limited and The SE Limited, 5 & 6, debuted during 1899. Does the System ETT 7 include the Memphis Road too?

 

I realized we were talking about two very different things. An awful lot changed on the Frisco between 1895 and 1905. I'll post the ETT.

John