I was looking at the Intermountian FP7 on walthers.com and I saw pictures of the b/y one. I also saw they had an F7B in b/y, they look nice. My question is does anyone have one of these? Do you like them? Do you have pictures of one of them?
I have one Intermountain Frisco FP7. I had two on order, but after receiving the first, I backed out of the second. The IRC FP7 is not a bad model, and it runs silky smooth. As opposed to the Frisco F7B that Intermountain brought out along with the FP7, they got the FP7 correct - no dynamic brake. I still can't believe that a sophisticated model RR company like IRC brought out a Frisco F7B model with d/b !!!!!! Go figure! But they did ..... but again, they got the FP7 right ..... sans d/b. The model is generally well done - see the various posts that came out around the time this model was first introduced - 1Q, 2007. I posted a detailed review, several others did as well. My main problems with the IRC FP7 Frisco model are with the decor. The yellow is too light; the lettering font for the lettering and the numbers is way too thick. The windshield wipers are a joke, and should be removed and replaced immediately upon receiving one! The handrails are yellow, and need to be painted black. But ..... all these things are fixable, and the model is, given its basics, pretty well done. So, if you want a Frisco FP7, I'd recommend you go ahead and get the one you have found, but understand a few things need to be corrected if you want an accurate Frisco example. I have not yet launched the project to fix up the one I have - it is still in the box. In addition to the wsw, and other details to be added (change the horn, add spark arrestors, add speed recorder, add brake hoses and m/u hoses, add a radio antenna, modify the bottom headlight, and add a yellow beacon(?) ), my main task will be to correct the lettering and numbering font with Microscale 87-85 decals, using a technique that I was very successful with on the P2K FA/FB models. I'll also likely change out the couplers, using appropriate shorter shank Kadees to get the FP7 to couple closer. It sure beats the older Atlas FP7! Ken
Ken--Couldn't those Intermountain "F-7B's" with the dynamic brakes pass for one of the Frisco F-9B's numbered 5140-5152 that DID have dynamics? I think there was a B-unit companion for each EMD cab--18 F-3A's, 18 F-3B's, 22 F-7A's, 22 F-7B's, 12 FP-7A's (And for some reason 13 F-9B's). Tom
Tom - There are at least three differences that would make your idea of using the IRC F7B's as F9B's instead not quite valid: o The road numbers would be wrong. The IRC F7B's are numbered correctly for F7B's. o The side grills are wrong. The F9B used the Farr grill, while the F7B used the fabricated F7 grill as is on the model. o The d/b fan that is incorrectly on the IRC F7B is the older style small diameter one, that was used on the F7. The F9B's were equipped with the bigger diameter d/b fan that was used on the F9. (I forget the actual diameter measurments of each, but the F9 fan is significantly bigger. See Marre/Harper, p 88, SLSF 140, ex SLSF 5140). FYI, I had four IRC F7B's ordered, but only accepted two of them after I realized all the problems. I talked with IRC about it, and they admitted their error. They very kindly sent me the correct non-d/b panels, but I have yet to substitute them on my two models, which remain in the box they came in, as does the FP7 as I noted above. These fellows remain on my "to do" list. Ken
I had high hopes for them in N scale (Black and yellow), but the n scale version is mandarin and white. Oh well... Tom
What do you all think about the O&W Intermountain FP7? I am assuming the mechanism is good based on the previous comments but I am wondering about the color, printing and details. Anyone seen a pilot model? Ship IT on the Frisco! Rick
Rick - I've not seen the actual IRC red/orange color yet, so it's hard to tell. Given my SLSF experience with IRC ..... I didn't like the job they did on the HO Frisco FP7 and F7B models big time, and years ago they screwed up the coonskin herald on the IRC 50ft PS-1 SLSF boxcar kit, I'd wait until I see one first. Their SLSF covered hoppers - both P-S and ACF, were OK in my book. Generally, I enjoy IRC's products. Ken
Ken: I am curious as to what was wrong with the coonskin on the boxcar. Are you referring to the PS1 or the PS 5277 one?They are running another 6 road #'s of the latter. Bob Hoover FriscoFriend
Bob - I don't recall the IRC kit number, but it was the Frisco version of their 50ft PS-1 boxcar. I bought both kits - the two different road numbers offered. One of them was SLSF 7600. The coonskin herald on the car side was very poorly proportioned - not sharp corners, not tight enough curves as I recall. A year or two later, Kadee did their 50' PS-1 in SLSF. Their first release was SLSF 7600, same number as one of the IRC's. Kadee wouldn't confirm this, but I think they picked the same road number because of two reasons - they had good pics of the real SLSF 7600, and they wanted to show up IRC. That's why I remember the car number of one of the IRC's. Other than the poorly done Frisco herald, the IRC looked like a good kit. Once I saw the Kadee, however, I put both of my IRC's (both still in the box, unbuilt) on eBay and sold them. If IRC is going to do more SLSF boxcars, have them look at Kadee's coonskin as a good example, not what IRC did on their 50ft PS-1. Ken
Kadee 50' PS-1 Actually, Kadee's first release of a Frisco 50' PS-1 boxcar was numbered SL-SF 7566 (stock # 6002). The second one was SL-SF 7600 (stock # 6007).
Pensive - Whatever, but I don't think that is correct. Kadee 6007, SLSF 7600, was the first Frisco 50ft PS-1 introduced; it was a twin in terms of decor to the first 40ft PS-1, SLSF 18299, Kadee 5206. They both had the red-oxide roof and ends, "Ship it" scheme, and red oxide roof walk decor. I was one (not the only) who was working with Kadee to get them to do this scheme on their new 50ft PS-1 model. It went out of stock at Kadee in Sept, 2000. SLSF 7566, Kadee 6002, was the second Frisco 50ft PS-1 introduced, as I recall. It didn't go out of stock at Kadee until Feb, 2002. It used the same decor as Kadee 6007, but had a galvanized roof walk in lieu of the red oxide walk. They wouldn't have done that on their first release. Kadee's item numbers are not an indication of the order in which they were released. There are many examples of this "random" numbering in the huge list of HO RTR cars Kadee has done. Don't know why they do that. But, it doesn't matter ..... the point of my posting above (and we are getting off-topic in this IRC FP7 thread!) was that as soon as Kadee released SLSF 7600, it made the IRC car look bad because of the poor IRC coonskin herald, and, as a result, I got rid of both of the IRC kits I had - one of which was SLSF 7600. I don't remember the other number. Personally, I don't like 50ft or longer cars anyway - too long to look good on HO curves, to modern, take up too much space on the layout (or shelf). Ken ps - A bit of trivia ..... Kadee 5206, 40ft PS-1 SLSF 18299, held the record for a couple of years at Kadee as the car that went out of stock the fastest. That initial success on the first Frisco product in their line of HO RTR cars is a significant reason why they have introduced many follow-up Frisco cars. I still think Kadee 5206 is the best looking car they have done.
Kadee PS-1 Ken, Since you were involved in the initial making of the 50' PS-1, your explanation of the production timeline seems reasonable. I looked over my collection of Kadee 50' Frisco cars and 7600 is the only one with a red roofwalk-a sign of an early release. Intermountain did make a 40' PS-1 in the Ship it on the Frisco! scheme, and again got the coonskin logo wrong. The white outline was too wide and the registration was off, which made for an odd looking car. I wish Kadee would make a double door 50 footer and an AAR 50 ton hopper in a Frisco paint scheme. It seems like it would be a simple matter since the tooling is already done. Rich
Rich - Amen! I also wish Kadee would do the 50ft DD PS-1 in Frisco, and for sure the AAR hopper in Frisco! As I noted above, I don't want many 50+ ft boxcars, but I would get at least one Kadee DD if they would do it, for my collection and because it would be a real good looking car. The 50-ton AAR hopper - ah yes! I'd like that, being a hopper, covered hopper, and tank car nut! I don't understand why Kadee has not done this car in Frisco yet. This Kadee car is really well done - I have it in Monon and in C&A. I really like the coal loads as well. In Frisco colors, this would be a good looker and a good seller, I'm sure. Perhaps it's a matter of documentation. To their credit, Kadee is a real stickler about getting these HO models as correct as they can, and they want good solid documentation of what they looked like and what details are on them. They prefer builder photos. I recall there was a good pic or two of the Frisco AAR's in RP Cyc. Perhaps it's time to get in touch with Kadee again! I think it might be time for them to put a good looking car or two in their upcoming releases, as to me at least, their recent introductions have been "ho-hum", even the Frisco ones. After all, how many Frisco 40ft PS-1's do we need? Ken ps - I like your screen name. Pensive and Ponder, E8's SLSF 2017 and 2018, ran together often on No's 3 & 4 and No's 9 & 10 when I was a freshman at MSM in Rolla, 1960-61. The Dean of Admissions at MSM then was a fellow named Paul Ponder who I got to know and liked, so I could easily relate to these two Racehorses when they came through town. I was often close to the tracks when they came through for one reason or another (except for #10 - ZZZZZZ time).
Ken, I would encourage you to contact Kadee and lobby for those two cars. I seems that you would have a leg up since you've worked with them before. Rich
I agree that Intermountain PS-1 was just too wrong to put on the layout so I never ordered them. On the other hand, I got several of the Kadee PS-1s, removed the road numbers and renumbered with Oddballs decals. With a little weathering (which these cars had an abundance of) the new numbers blended in well. I have not had success renumbering their cement hopper as I cannot find a numeral set as fragile the original numbers. I am open for suggetions. I am going to need these cars when I switch back to 1975-78 in about a year. Hope those new Athearn SD40-2s are close. Ship IT on the Frisco! Rick
I masked around the number with regular Scotch tape and used a Q-Tip dipped in Dio-Sol (no longer available). The best results came when I used the dry brush technique with the Q-Tip, using the Dio-Sol sparingly. It only took 8-10 swipes and the number was gone. The down side was that the area was very shiney, good for decals but it did not match the rest of the car. That is where the magic of weathering blended the shiney number area with the surrounding satin/dull finish quite well. BTW I use Floquil Rust and Grimey Black for weathering. Today I would try either the Testors Universal Thinner or Scalecoat II thinner. No plans to do that in the near future but, when I do, I will try to let you know what happens. Changing numbers on an expensive car is not for the faint of heart. I used extra numbers from Oddballs decals I they are very thin and have a very close font size and style. I renumbered 10 of #18299 and smaller numbers of the later releases. I am very happy with the results. I had the same decent results removing numbers from the cement hoppers. Now if I could just find some good numerals. Ship IT on the Frisco! Rick
Rick - Thanks! I'll give it a try as I also have several examples of the first two Kadee 40ft Frisco PS-1 cars - the "Ship it" and the "Faster Freight". Following those two, I just bought one of each as they came out as I knew Kadee had plans to continue releasing SLSF PS-1's with different numbers and details as long as they kept selling, which they have. That's a testimony to how good Frisco cars looked, as well as to how popular the road was. But, when the SLSF PS-2 covered hopper came out, I got several of both numbers. Love that car! Dio-Sol was essentially just a mixed xylene. You can buy a bottle of mixed xylenes at any chemical or drug supply house (I have a quart). But, be careful of the stuff - there is a reason Floquil no longer uses that system. Spraying it and breathing all that xylene is NO GOOD for your system. I had a good friend who, I believe, paid the price for that, dying of cancer. I haven't sprayed "old" Floquil for at least ten years, though I still have some that I brush on. I assume the Dio-Sol did not impact the body color, except for the "shine" on the finish you mentioned? I have a technique of hiding decal surfaces using a super-fine Microbrush, Polly-Scale flat, and an Optivisor, well lit under my "Busch Stadium" lights (!). However, I don't think it would work if I had to lay the Polly-Scale flat onto the body surface around the decal perimiter as well, as I fear it would be visible vs. the surrounding area. The decals just disappear under the stuff, OddBalls and MicroScale being the best at it. Ken
Ken, I believe that the carbody color on almost every Kadee car is the pigment of the plastic itself. I am confident that using too much of a solvent based thinner like Dio-Sol would have attacked the plastic and made a real mess of a nice car. That is why I used a dry brush/Q-Tip approach to minimize the damage to the plastic. All that I noticed was a real shiney surface. As these cars came out, I emailed Kadee asking for instructions on renumbering. Sam said he had no recommendations but sent me several scrap car sides (Frisco sides, but it broke my heart to know that somewhere some SLSF cars had been aborted) to practice on. That is where I made my little discovery. Hope this helps because the scrap car sides are long gone. Ship IT on the Frisco! Rick
Ken, After reading your review, I may be better off getting an undec FP7 (with no DBs) and painting & decaling it myself. At least I'd get the correct colors. Or at least re-decaling the painted model, adding proper details, and weathering it up to try to hide the faded yellow. I do thank you for the review- I'm wanting an FP7 to try to model Trains 709/710. Rick- from looking at the ads from Athearn for the SD40-2s, they should have nose Gyralites. They look like they'll still need plow pilots added, though. And I hope you like GP38-2s, as you'll need a lot of them (LOL). I model the last five years of the Frisco myself, with brief forays into the 1950s (thus the RS1, RS2M, 44-tonner, and the E8A in my collection), and so far I have 9 of the '38s. I'm following your comment of modeling 10% of the active roster in a certain time frame.
