Kansas City Interchanges 1980

Discussion in 'Freight Operations' started by Iantha_Branch, Jul 24, 2021.

  1. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    I'm doing a bit of research for a potential future layout. I'm trying to put together a complete list of railroads that interchanged with the Frisco in Kansas City on the west side where Rosedale and 19th st yards were. Here's what I have so far:

    ATSF
    UP
    MP
    MKT
    BN
    KCS
    CRIP/SP depending on at what point in 1980 we're looking at
    CNW
    MILW
    NW
    ICG

    And depending on how you want to look at it, the Frisco operations over on the east side of town where the Clinton sub starts.

    How does my list look? If there's anything I missed or erroneously added let me know.
     
  2. tferk

    tferk Member Frisco.org Supporter

    You got all 11 trunk lines correct for 1980. Add in the Kansas City Terminal Rwy (KCT) as they had industries that they served exclusively.

    The Clinton Sub is kind of a different subject. It was served out of 19th St Yard, where the local originated and terminated - it could run as far south as East Lynne, but usually turned at Harrisonville or Grandview. By 1980, it typically did not make the turn all in one day, but would lay over somewhere and come north the following day. I am modeling the Sheffield-Centropolis-Leeds corridor in 1979, focused on the parallel Frisco and MP lines between the KCT and 17th Street.
     
  3. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    As always, I appreciate the explanation Ted.
     
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  4. Karl

    Karl 2008 Engineer of the Year Frisco.org Supporter

  5. Gabriel G.

    Gabriel G. Member

    Ethan,

    About a year ago, I posted a thread on Frisco's major interchange partners that included some data from a 1966 report by the Interstate Commerce Commission. Admittedly, this data was published 14+ years prior to the time period you're interested in, but I doubt traffic flows changed all that much in Kansas City between 1966 and 1980 aside from an increase in the total volume of traffic interchanged.
     

    Attached Files:

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  6. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    I appreciate that Karl, that answers some additional questions I was going to ask at a later point.

    I had looked at that last night. Its good reference for the Frisco's more frequent partners, but leaves out several of the railroads that the Frisco interchanged with.
     
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  7. Gabriel G.

    Gabriel G. Member

    Ethan,

    Great news. Last night, I found a set of ICC documents pertaining to the BN-SLSF merger and it included a full list of Frisco's interchange partners at Kansas City as of 1976, complete with carload totals.
     

    Attached Files:

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  8. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    Excellent find! Thank you so much for sharing that.

    I'm a little confused by the terms the table uses. Is there some sort of guide to understanding the table?

    I'm surprised at how low the totals are for some of the roads. I would guess the NW and ICG probably changed more cars with the Frisco at points further east, and the KCS and MKT served mostly the same area as the Frisco being the cause.
     
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  9. Gabriel G.

    Gabriel G. Member

    Ethan,

    Allow me to explain what the different categories are in simple terms.

    Originated: Carloads originated on the Frisco, bound for customers on other railroads.

    Terminated: Carloads originated on other railroads, bound for customers located on the Frisco.

    Overhead: Carloads originated on other railroads, bound for customers on other railroads, aka. bridge traffic.
     
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  10. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

  11. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    Something I'm curious about,

    Of that list of railroads, does anyone have any idea which of them would have still been running transfers with SW type units, and who might have started using older GP units by 1980?

    This video does give some hints, but its from somewhere 72-74 time range


    From that video, it looked like the ATSF, CNW, UP and ICG had started using GP units. The Frisco, Rock, BN, KCT and MKT were still using SW units. I didn't see anything from MP, NW, KCS or MILW in that video.
     
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  12. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    Something I didn't consider when I started this thread was the names of the yards that the Frisco transferred traffic to and from. I have a nice map that not only lays out all of KC, but also has information on which yards specifically that transfers went to. I took it with my phone, so it's not the best quality but I can try sharing it. Here's what I have

    ATSF - Argentine Yard
    UP - Armstrong Yard
    MP - Neff Yard
    MKT - Glenn Park Yard
    BN - Murray Yard
    KCS - Henning St Yard
    CRIP - Armourdale Yard
    CNW - Ohio St. Yard
    MILW - East Yard
    NW - Avondale Yard
    ICG - 12th St Yard
    KCT - Mill St Yard

    The destination for CNW Transfers is just labeled CNW Yard. Is there a specific name for this yard? Maybe something going back to the CGW days? (This question was answered in a subsequent post)
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 19, 2022
  13. klrwhizkid

    klrwhizkid Administrator Staff Member Administrator Frisco.org Supporter

    KCS Yard in Kansas City is Knoche Yard
     
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  14. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    That's what I had originally. That map I posted shows every other road but the Frisco dropping at Knoche. The map says the Frisco dropped at what I think says Menning St Yard.
     
  15. tferk

    tferk Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Henning St Yard, not Menning. Henning Street Yard was where the joint KCS-MILW freight house was located, near Rudy Patrick Seed.

    In the late 70s early 80s, Mopac was still using SW1200 (usually pairs) on transfer runs in the KC area.

    The ex-CGW yard (CNW) was Ohio Street Yard, located about 8th St just south of the Missouri River levee in the West Bottoms. A lot of that area has been completely reconfigured with I-70 and such.

    Note the KCS yard (joint with MILW) in the East Bottoms was actually a complex consisting of East Yard, used for inbounds, and Knoche Yard, used for outbounds.
     
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  16. Iantha_Branch

    Iantha_Branch Member

    Thank you for the clarification. The map is a bit blurry and I couldn't quite make out the spelling.

    I will go update the list to include Ohio St Yard.
     
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