Want Manufacturers To Produce Prototype Building And Depot Models For Frisco

Discussion in 'General' started by FRISCO4503, Aug 12, 2012.

  1. FRISCO4503

    FRISCO4503 FRISCO4503 Frisco.org Supporter

    Not long ago I posted that I would like to see manufacturers make smaller prototypical locomotives instead of all the big power.

    Well in light of that, I have done some thinking and it isn't just about the motive power, or the rolling stock.

    What about the scenery?

    All I have ever seen in the way of Frisco buildings in any scale are the 2 depots that were or are in Missouri. Blair Missouri is one of them and I cant recall the other. I have seen many post cards and pictures of depots from long ago, yet, these are the only 2 models of Frisco depots available that I know about.

    Why not get a manufacturer like Walthers to recreate depots like Union Station in St Louis MO, which is a rather large depot, or Cherryvale depot in Kansas. I know there are plans out there somewhere to recreate this one, but all I have ever seen are post cards and pictures.

    However, the depot in Cherryvale is a depot I would enjoy having on my layout when I get it built. There is a wealth of opportunity here for a model producing company to make a killing off of our organization here when it comes to modeling.

    Mostly we get a new car or locomotive here and there to hit the shelves and sometimes on a limited run basis, why not make a lot of these buildings available.

    Here on Frisco.org there are quite a few of you folks I would love to spend some time picking your brains to educate me to the fullest on our railroad. I know what I have read and not much more than that.

    I think it is because I want to stay just under the radar of being classified as a rivet counter. But, when it comes to my modeling, I am a stickler for having at least a few prototypical locales on my soon to be home railroad. Cherryvale depot is one of those since it holds a lot of sentimental value in my own life.

    Can someone tell me if there is ever the slightest possibility of this coming to fruition?
     
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  2. FRISCO4503

    FRISCO4503 FRISCO4503 Frisco.org Supporter

    Also, how about the Leather Rock Hotel?

    From what I have read, the hotel was used for passengers riding the rails from both the Frisco and the Santa Fe, it was also the Railroad YMCA for crews from both afore mentioned railroads. Today it is the home of the Cherry Valley Modelers Association!

    This is the club where I got my start. They are a fabulous group of guys and some of them taught me a lot when it comes to modeling and railroad history. Some never lost faith in me and are part of the reason I am who I am today.

    Either way, I would like to pay homage to my up bringing and my inspiration into this great hobby. And if there is no other way that I can do that, other than to model that part of history, then that is what I would like to do.

    But I am not much anymore for scratch building, nor do I know where to get my hands on plans for such a thing to build it myself, so I am a huge fan of the ready made kits.

    As long as they are close to right!
     
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  3. SAFN SAAP

    SAFN SAAP Member

    Please allow me to share part of an AMB message that was given to me when I contacted them regarding the reproduction of a S.A. & A.P. depot as a kit. It is an eye opener.

    1.) Most customers have chosen to purchase a minimum run, which is 200 kits, at dealer discount (40% off MSRP) and received one year exclusive selling rights before AMB adds the kit to its catalog of products. Most recently this option was used by the MoPac Historical Society on their Drover Caboose, which is now our Kit No. 883 and 884.

    2.) Another option is for the customer to pay for full development costs and own the rights for producing the kit. CAD drawings to our specifications may be provided by the customer to help reduce costs and they can even provide their own packaging if they have those capabilities. With this option they may order any quantity of kits whenever they like. Most customers, without the ability of providing their own drawings, instructions, and packaging however, find this arrangement to usually be cost prohibitive.

    With either option you choose, you're probably looking at a minimum investment of $5000 - $6000 by the time the finished product leaves our dock. If this cost is what you were anticipating and would like to proceed further, the next phase would be to send us some information on the prototype you would like to have reproduced (assuming HO scale) so we can determine the feasibility of its reproduction in kit form.

    Therefore, I must surmise that the prospect to be modeled must be vetted to make sure that it can and will sell, to recoup R&D costs. That being said, with Frisco being vastly ignored by the mainstream modeling industry, I don't think that you'll get much response.

    The secondary market or scratch-building is the way you will most likely have to go, unless you have the cash to pony for the R&D.
     
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  4. Oldguy

    Oldguy Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Frisco4503,

    The other depot is Walnut Grove depot by Blair Line.

    But then, he is a Frisco modeler. And I would agree that kit makers have to look at the market available. I bought a Walnut Grove kit since it is a different style and may bite the bullet and get the Blairstown version as well.

    At least I'll two good Frisco depots, but will have to kitbash/scratch others. Just the short Clinton branch has no 2 depots the same, so I got lucky with Blair Line. But even if someone would make a "standard" Frisco depot, I doubt that it would be all that accurate for everyone.

    I like the Frisco, but not down to the ninth degree. I'm using what is close and available. The bridge in Bolivar, for example. I bought the Walther's Art Deco bridge and will kit bash it a bit. Won't be exact, but it'll have to do.

    I guess we'll just have to get what is available and be thankful for what is produced.
     
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  5. FRISCO4503

    FRISCO4503 FRISCO4503 Frisco.org Supporter

    I appreciate the input.

    And have come to a better understanding of the availability of my wish list.

    Can anyone at Frisco.org show me where I might be able to get a blueprint style drawing of Cherryvale depot?

    I would love to try my hand at this since it is the only choice I have. If not a blue print, maybe a rough drawing of the top, front, back and sides of that particular depot. I know where I can acquire the Feather Rock Hotel.

    I just really like that little corner in Cherryvale, and during my real railroading days, I worked that location many times and would love to take that little walk thru history by recreating it on my home layout.

    Thanks for the input guys!
     
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  6. Joseph Toth

    Joseph Toth Member

    I imagine every model railroader has a wish list regardless of which railroad is modeled.

    We are living in trying times. We have lost many great brick and mortar mom and pop hobby shops to the internet, as well as small manufactures too in recent history. Developing a new product is expensive in itself but to develop and produce a specific depot, as an example, is almost next to impossible considering today's current costs.

    I see a trend among many modelers who now "proto-lance" their chosen railroad. You can model the Frisco as if it had expanded like Manny's SA&AP and SAF&N in South Texas. These railroads were taken over by SP "Robber Barons" shooting the Frisco out of the saddle!

    The Yoakum Railroad Empire consisted of the Frisco and Rock Island. He gained control of the Ft. Worth & Rio Grande so he could expand into South Texas. It later became a Santa Fe line ending his dream to expand deeper into the heart of the Lone Star State.

    With hundreds of depot kits having been produced for some 60+ years now, both craftsman and plastic. There are certainly several that can be modified to come very close to a specific Frisco depot without having to scratch build or as Manny mentions, invest your own money into a project to develop and produce a specific depot design to fit your model railroad.

    You will have your model but will other modelers purchase it just because it is another Frisco depot?

    My planned large scale Simplicity & Great Plains Railway will be loosely based on a name and layout taken from an old Atlas HO layout booklet. It will be "somewhere in West Texas". It will be a "paper" railroad explained as an extension built by the QA&P and operated as a Frisco subsidiary.

    For power I plan to use a QA&P GP7. I love GP7s! I still would like to see Frisco.org take the bull by the horns and see that a former Frisco geep gets preserved for current and future members to enjoy! There are enough members, and I am sure visitors too, who would back this project if properly organized!

    Where is the Yes We Can spirit anyway?

    In the meantime, model the Frisco your way with pride, regardless of scale. If there isn't a specific model to fit your requirements consider "proto-lancing". You will still capture the true spirit of the Frisco and keep model railroading fun, as it should be!

    Joe Toth
     
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  7. pensive

    pensive Member Frisco.org Supporter

  8. Oldguy

    Oldguy Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Not to be a smart a$$, but is it Feather Rock or Leatherock?

    Leatherock Hotel is a cool looking building.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 27, 2024
  9. FRISCO4503

    FRISCO4503 FRISCO4503 Frisco.org Supporter

    I am sorry.

    It is the Feather Rock Hotel.

    My bad!
     
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  10. mvtelegrapher

    mvtelegrapher Member

    It is the Leatherock Hotel Center, see their website:

    http://www.leatherockhotel.com/

    By the way, it was never a YMCA for train crews. In fact, I doubt if many railroad employees stayed in it since Cherryvale was never a crew change point. For many years after WWII it was an apartment building.

    There are many pictures of the Cherryvale Frisco depot on the internet. There maybe architectural plans for it either at the Springfield library or still with Louis Griesemer who purchased the old Frisco museum archives.

    Bob Wintle started scratch building an HO model of it several years ago for the old CVMRC layout but I think its gone now. Also, Don Richardson with the CVMRC kitbashed a Leatherock for the club layout, we still have it.

    John Chambers
    CVMRC Historian
     
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  11. FRISCO4503

    FRISCO4503 FRISCO4503 Frisco.org Supporter

    Thanks John,

    I know my knowledge was a little rusty, but now I got it.

    I do know the layout is in Don Richardson's old apartment, which is pretty cool! And the model of the Feather Rock Hotel Center that Don kitbashed is the one I was referring too. I just thought it would be nice to model that particular section on my own layout with the Frisco depot right at the diamond and the Santa Fe depot a block away.

    I have fond memories of Woodrows scratch built model of Cherryvale's Santa Fe depot and Don Richardson's model of downtown Cherryvale behind it.

    This was the source for my inspiration of the ability to capture the past in scale form.

    Thanks
     
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  12. bob_wintle

    bob_wintle Member Frisco.org Supporter

    I still have my model of the Cherryvale Frisco depot.

    I was never satisfied with the geometry of the roof lines. I especially do no like how the roof intersected the turret. I haven't been to Cherryvale in a couple of years so I am not sure if the foundation for it is still intact. I used it and photos to build mine.

    I judged the dimensions of the building using a 6'-8'' walk in door as my guide. I suggest instead of hoping for a manufacturer to market one, you find a club to join and get a mentor to help you learn to scratch build.

    Join the National Model Railroad Association (NMRA) and get involved in the achievement program. You will be amazed at what you will learn and the fun you will have. Not to mention the new friends you will make.

    Whatever you do have fun.
     
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  13. FRISCO4503

    FRISCO4503 FRISCO4503 Frisco.org Supporter

    Thank you Bob,

    I have pondered joining the NMRA and San Antonio Model Railroaders Association (SAMRA) for quite some time! I wish I had learned to talk less and learn more when I was with the Cherryvale Group.

    Glad I am grown up enough to admit that now!
     
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  14. bob_wintle

    bob_wintle Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Will,

    To me learning something new is the most fun part of our hobby.

    I was able to learn many things on my journey to my MMR. There are numerous guys on this forum who helped me on my journey. They all know who they are. One will not find a better group to be involved with than this group.

    Thanks again to all my Frisco buddies.
     
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  15. FRISCO4503

    FRISCO4503 FRISCO4503 Frisco.org Supporter

    We had a train show here at the beginning of the month and I met Manny in person from this group. It is a blessing to have someone from this group close by and I hope to get together with him sometime when I have more time and we can talk.

    I agree Bob, so far, everyone has been very helpful to me and others. I try to read all posts and comments so I might learn something I hadn't thought of yet or just general Frisco knowledge. I have never met a finer group of guys. I am also blessed to have grown up around some like you, Mike Peters, Don Richardson and John Chambers.

    I had some pretty good teachers. In fact I have to share this. I remember my first train set I bought at the local grocery store in Independence, Kansas. It was a Bachmann and had a UP F7A as the power. Man I thought I was ready for the big leagues.

    Then I heard about the club in Cherryvale. On many occasions if Don Guilespie wasn't going or I didn't catch him in time to catch a ride, I would walk the old Santa Fe tracks which weren't in use by anyone at the time, to Cherryvale to attend the Friday night meets. I have to confess I had no idea the Frisco Railway even existed.

    One Friday night they had an auction for one of the members of the club whom had passed on. I cannot remember who it was, but, he had a very large collection of Frisco Athearn power. I was mowing a lot of yards that year so I had a little money to burn so I bought a few engines with the intention to repaint those Frisco engines in the UP scheme.

    That was until Don Richardson took me aside and explained to me where the Frisco mainline was and a brief summary of the Frisco Railroad At that point I was hooked!

    I took my box of treasures home and immediately went and bought the spray paint to repaint that Bachmann F7A in Frisco. It was a crude paint scheme at best, but I haven't had a desire to model any other railroad since. I thought this was a funny story because at first there was nothin better than Union Pacific until I discovered Frisco.

    Now, UP who?
     
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