Frisco Refrigerator lines

Discussion in 'General' started by Frisco2008, Sep 28, 2008.

  1. Frisco2008

    Frisco2008 Member Frisco.org Supporter

    I found this photo of the McAllen, TX depot, ca +- 1930.

    Does anyone else have any information or photos of these reefers?
     
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  2. Frisco2008

    Frisco2008 Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    Well, OK no picture yet...fussy software.
     
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  3. Frisco2008

    Frisco2008 Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    OK, Here';s another try...
     
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  4. bob_wintle

    bob_wintle Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    It looks as though you are having the same problem in uploading your photos' that I had when I first started to upload mine. I ended up having to have my 17 year old show me how to reduce them in size. I sure wish I could remember what she showed me. I will ask her again tonight and post a hint later. Good luck and I am looking forward to seeing your photos'
    Bob Wintle
     
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  5. Frisco2008

    Frisco2008 Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    Take a look at my photo alblum. there are 2 pics there.
     
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  6. TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020)

    TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020) Passed Away July 15, 2020 Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    I'm a poor one to give advice on computer problems, but I had success (after I had a picture scanned or saved) by emailing it to myself. Then save that image from the email and then post it to the board. I don't know any of the computer science behind all that but it worked for me. I've posted about fifty photos here doing it that way.

    Tom
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 30, 2008
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  7. bob_wintle

    bob_wintle Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    I just talked to my daughter and the way she did it was to save my photos to her Photo bucket site then uploaded them to this site from there. Way over my head but that it what she said.
    Bob Wintle
     
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  8. Rick McClellan

    Rick McClellan 2009 Engineer of the Year

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    Bob,

    Are you talking about the 222000 and 333000 series reefers? If so, I remember seeing these cars at Kraft Foods in Springfield dedicated to cheese service. Now the doors that served these cars on the east side of the building have been bricked in.

    Ship IT on the Frisco!

    Rick
     
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  9. John Sanders

    John Sanders Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    The Frisco Refrigerator Line car in your photo is from group of 2500 cars built by ACF, lot 6346, and delivered in late 1912 and early 1913. FRL was an independent car line, but coincidentally the offices were in the Frisco Building in St Louis and the shops were listed as being in Springfield. FRL cars were lised on a separate page of the ORER from the Frisco and C&EI until April 1920. FRL was dissolved with cars 1 through 1000 assigned (and renumbered) to C&EI. Cars 1001 though 2500 were assigned to SLSF. On December 7, 1920 C&EI sold their cars to FGE and lasted into the late 1940s. Frisco kept their cars and ran about 600 of them through a rebuild program in the Monett car shops in 1923 through 1925. Additional Frisco cars were converted to ventilated box cars and regular box cars. Some Frisco cars survived into the 1950s as ice cars (in addition to the MDT cars), but were mostly retired from interchange service by the early 1930s.
    One ACF builder's photo survives. Millard Smart had a lettering arrangement for these cars dated 1915. He loaned it to a live steam group in Kansas City, but may not have been returned. I would like to have some decals made...possibly by Art Griffin. The attached photo is not clear enough to do art work. A better broadside photo or drawing is needed. Anyone interested in modeling the strawberry harvests in the teens and 20s needs these cars!
    John Sanders

    FILE4028.JPG FILE5280.JPG
     
  10. yardmaster

    yardmaster Administrator Staff Member Administrator Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    A whole separate thread to come, but I've slowly been assimilating info from the old FEM's on strawberry movements in the 1920s up to the early 1930s. This thread provides some motivation to wrap it up!
     
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  11. billkarisch

    billkarisch Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    I AM INTERESTED IN THE VENTILATED CARS SHOWN IN THE PICTURE. EVIDENTLY CARRIERS OF THAT ERA USED A LOT OF THEM FOR PRODUCE, NOT TO MENTION THEIR VISATILITY FOR BACKHAULS AS A BOX CAR. CHECKING A 1918 LIST OF EQUIPMENT ON ONE OF THE SLB&M'S CONNECTIONS, THE SAN ANTONIO & ARANSAS PASS RWY., I SEE THAT THEY HAD 1745 VENTILATED CARS TO ONLY 50 REEFERS.
    SINCE BOTH RAILROADS WERE AFTER A LOT OF THE SAME PRODUCE FROM THE TEXAS VALLEY, I WONDER IF THE FRISCO'S LINES HAD A SIMILAR RATIO?
     
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  12. yardmaster

    yardmaster Administrator Staff Member Administrator Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    I dusted off the the '43 ORER; at least by this date, 2728 was gone. I'll have to look more carefully at all of the different notes to see if there were any ventilated boxcars that I'm missing under different numbers.

    Westerfield has some ACL USRA clone vented boxcars that look like they'd be a good starting point for the courageous kitbasher.

    John, do you or others have any dimensions on the SL-SF ventilated boxcars, vis-a-vis outside length/width/height from rail, door openings?

    Best Regards,
     
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  13. John Sanders

    John Sanders Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    I do not have dimensions for the ventilated cars, but they would be similar to those of the refrigerator cars. Without having all of the ORER volumes I would guess the number of ventilated cars (2501 to 2999) increased as the refrigerator cars declined. My records show 480 vent. cars in both 1931 and 1932. By then the refrigerator car totals were down to 95 and 91 respectively. The refrigerator cars totaled over 1400 as late as January 1924, dropped to about 1200 in Sept 1925. These totals would include original FRL cars (renumbered and probably repainted) and rebuilt cars. Totals for the refrigerator cars dropped to 576 cars in 1927, so many of the missing cars might be conversions to ventilated cars.

    For modeling the refrigerator cars, Sunshine models makes a truss rod Burlington reefer with angled queen posts that at least has the look of the FRL car. A model of the ventilated car might use the same kit. Bill Welch, FGEX enthusiast, has built a model of the FGEX car series that came from the C&EI.

    John Sanders

    FILE496.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 11, 2008
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  14. John Sanders

    John Sanders Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    The attached photo is in the background of a Fayetteville depot photo from the collection of Tom Galbraith. The refrigerator cars are shown in their post-FRL appearance...after the split of the FRL and after the SLSF rebuild. I am guessing about 1925. Once again we have a photo that has great atmosphere, but is not quite clear enough to produce decal art.

    John Sanders

    FRL_Car_Fayetteville_AR_ca_1925.jpg
     
  15. Coonskin

    Coonskin Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    So, am I understanding correctly that the FRL 1010 car would have been built in 1912?

    A guy wants to make V scale model of it for use on my SLSF 1908 route I'm building, but it may be too "new". :D
     
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  16. John Sanders

    John Sanders Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    The roster page (at the bottom of the page) shows build dates of 1911 and 1912. ACF build lists show 1912 and 1913 build dates for the 2500 cars. Sorry but you would have to move your time period up a little bit for your V-scale car.

    John Sanders
     
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  17. Coonskin

    Coonskin Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    Thanks John for the reply and data. So much for THAT SLSF reefer!

    Do you have any idea what the Frisco used for refeers during 1908?

    Andre
     
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  18. FriscoCharlie

    FriscoCharlie Administrator Staff Member Administrator Frisco.org Supporter

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    [​IMG]

    Wow, wouldn't I like to have that in an N Scale model!

    Charlie
     
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  19. John Sanders

    John Sanders Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    Give this a try. This link is to a collection of car diagrams produced in (about 1902). The diagrams were done in pencil and painted in actual car paint. The refrigerator car is lettered in the early Yoakum scheme: Frisco System. This may be the only pre-FRL lettering information to survive. The logo is similar to the old Frisco System box car seen in a Vista, MO thread.

    http://digitalcollections.missouristate.edu/cdm4/document.php?CISOROOT=/Frisco&CISOPTR=17&REC=2

    The late 1890s ORER issues show that the KCFS&M had several (fewer than 75) refrigerators in several types (Hanrahan etc.) These were likely on the roster to serve the fruit growing area between Fordland and Thayer, MO. A photo of the fruit packing house at St Elmo, MO (near West Plains) shows lots of cars. The cars may be Armour, or ART...the lettering does not show clearly in the photos.


    The second link shows the unknown cars at St Elmo. Both photos are in the Missouri State Digital Image collection.

    http://library.missouristate.edu/projects/fruitfulheritage/scripts/full.php?slideid=104

    John Sanders
     
  20. John Sanders

    John Sanders Member

    Re: Frisco Refrigerater lines

    The Frisco System refrigerator car is on page 07.

    John
     
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