Here is a copy of the oldest Frisco List of Stations that I have yet seen. Unfortunately the paper is going fast and I hated to destroy it making the scan ... so some of the inside information didn't show up very well. If something that someone needs got missed, pm me and I'll get the book back out.
Sharp eyes will notice in the Junction Points and Connection section, p101-103, that at Arcadia, Kan, Lamar, Mo, and Liberal, Mo the Frisco had connections with the KCCS. It's a bit of "trickery" that the Frisco used to avoid the appearance of having three routes between KC and Springfield. More on this later.
I'm confused on what your saying here The Frisco had connections with MoPac at Liberal and Lamar, not KCS. Now there was a KCS crossing 8 miles (by rail travel) to the "North" (West, but by rail its North)
You might notice that Bonanza Arkansas has a junction with the KCS. Skip to Poteau, IT and you find two junctions, KCS and Mo & La. I don't know of another Frisco source that even acknowledged a KCS junction at Bonanza. It's not on any early Frisco ETT that I've seen. The 1920 station list shows the connection at Bonanza as Mo & La. The actual situation was always that KCS owned several miles of mine spur track at Bonanza but leased it to the Missouri and Louisiana (Central Coal & Coke). It seems like the junctions listed in the 1907 book are "by the book" (original lease?) rather than operational, like the Bonanza junction in the 1920 list- if that makes any sense.
John: GREAT resource for this TOC19 enthusiast!! Thanks for taking the (considerable) time and effort to post this. Did you happen to notice that as late as this 1907 publishing date... the turntable at Winslow was still supposed to be there???? I thought it was removed very early on. Your thoughts? Andre Ming
I'm sorry if this question betrays a lot of ignorance, but I am a complete noob when it comes to railroads. I'm a research assistant for a journalist writing a book about the Tulsa Race Riot/Massacre. One of the important figures in the book came to Tulsa from Water Valley, Mississippi in 1913. The information we've gathered is that he took a train from St. Louis to Tulsa and that it was likely on the Frisco line. My question is this: if a man takes a Frisco train to Tulsa from St. Louis in 1913, would that train have departed from Union Station in St. Louis? This maybe so obvious as to not even merit an answer, but I've looked around this site a lot over the last few days and I'm not clear on whether all or just some of the Frisco lines left St. Louis from the Union Station.
Yes, the Frisco train from StL to Tulsa would have departed from Union Station. Regarding the 1907 list of Frisco stations, notice that a Kirkwood station is listed - South Kirkwood by name. This depot was located at Kirkwood Road and the tracks - west side of Kirkwood Rd, north side of the tracks. It was later removed - the Hill Behan lumber yard was later located there for many years, now also gone. Even later, a very small depot was relocated there, but on the south side of the tracks, still on the west side of the road. If I recall correctly the small depot was relocated from Anaconda, Mo. It also was ultimately removed. A few years ago, Windsor Spring and I had several visits with the Kirkwood Historical Society on a search for a picture of that original South Kirkwood station. No luck, but I believe a small plan of the station was found. K
A Frisco passenger riding from St. Louis to Tulsa on the Frisco in 1913 would have boarded at Union Station. Frisco joined the Terminal Railway Association of St. Louis on June 9, 1902 according to Issue 75 "Meteor" of the Terminal Railroad Association Historical and Technical Society (2015). The TRRA operated Union Station for its member railroads. The 1910 Official Guide introduces a little wrinkle; It lists a station stop at Tower Grove (mp 3) for all long-distance trains including the premier train #9 The Meteor leaving at 2:30 PM with a stop at Tower Grove eight minutes later. However, since the Tulsa participant came from Mississippi, it is most likely he boarded his train at Union Station. It is interesting no stops for long-distance trains are listed for Webster Groves in 1910. The Meteor had no scheduled stops until Pacific, an hour and 34 miles out. The schedule for #11 shows additional stops at Valley Park (mp 18) and Eureka (mp 27). Its counterpart train, #12, shows conditional stops everywhere between Newburgh and St. Louis for "...passengers from Southwestern Div. points."
