I thought I would start a modeling thread relating to adhesives. Everyone chime in with your recommendations. I'll start with several. 1) Plastic to metal, or anything to anything. The best cyanoacrylate-type glue I have found is CoolChem cyanopoxy. It will glue to HDPE plastics! I have not tried Delrin, but I wouldn't be surprised if CoolChem's CA would do it! I discovered their product at a woodworking show, but is only available direct: http://www.coolchem.com/ 2) Styrene, Butyrate, ABS, Acrylic plastics - Ambroid PRO WELD. Helpful hint, get yourself a Touch-N-Flow applicator. It is a glass pipette made by the folks at www.flex-i-file.com with a very small metal syringe-like tip that will allow you to precisely control flow and placement of this solvent type glue. 3) Bond anything to anything - clear and flexible. J & Z Products Super Z-R/C 56. I discovered this fine adhesive while working in the hobby shop. It was used to attach canopies, windshields and windows to R/C airplanes but I have used it for many other things as well where transparency and possibly flexibility mattered. This is very good for laying down wiring in body shells. NOTE: Pacer Technologies (also Robart) PT56 Formula 560 canopy glue is a "clone" of this and is available from Walthers. 4) Track to decking - DAP Dynaflex 230 #18305 clear This clear-drying caulk is an excellent adhesive for gluing track down. Squeeze about a 1/8" - 3/16" bead down the centerline of the roadbed and spread the width of the ties with a putty knife that has a serrated edge. Place some weights on the track for about 60 minutes. The very thinnest layer is all that is necessary to hold the track in place it does not need to squeeze up between the ties (don't put under turnout moving parts). The track is actually removable using a very thin edge putty knife later if necessary.
Re: Glues - what to use. Keith - Good topic suggestion! I'm pretty comfortable with Tenax 7R solvent cement, though I also have, and use, several others, including Ambroid Pro-Weld, Testors, Plastruct, and my own brew based on acetone. I also had a small bottle of methylene chloride, but alas it has all escaped into the atmosphere. It was pretty good for special problems, but you had to work fast! (and don't breath much while using it) I have the Touch-N-Flow applicator you mention, but have equal success with a small drafting ink pen from my MSM days, and find it easier to use and keep clean. The Plastruct solvent cement has a bad habit of gumming up the applicator - bad for that small tube on the Touch-N-Flow! For CA, I use both types of "Hot Stuff". I keep them in a fridge we have downstairs (for the beer, of course!), and a bottle will last a couple of years in there. I take it out, use it, and put it back immediately. For those special problems - there is also always a tube of Walthers "Goo" around. Plus, MicroScale Kristal Kleer proves to be a very useful water-based, clear drying cement for a number of uses. It's very much like Elmer's, but not as thick. Ken
Re: Glues - what to use. I believe if you check the ingredients, that you will find that the active ingredient in both Tenax 7R and Ambroid Pro-Weld is Methylene Chloride. Keep it in a small neck bottle to slow down evaporation. I seldom use anything else on styrene. On a side note, Methylene Chloride is highly Carcinogenic. I have a freind in the chemical business who is the major supplier of paint thinnners and such to Sherwin-Williams, and he won't sell Methylene Chloride in less than 55 gallon drums due to EPA handleing restrictions. If they package MC in less than 55 gallon drums, he has to give all his employees a special, expensive, cancer test every year. The look on his face when I told him that I used it almost daily said it all. When I explained what I was doing with it he relaxed, but, basically, he said,"it evaporates so fast you probably don't smell it, but if you smell it, you are too close, or you used too much." Kent in KC
Re: Glues - what to use. Correct, but in the commercial products, the methylene chloride is diluted with other solvents. Methylene chloride is CH2CL2, so it's a small molecule, can easily disolve other organics, and is very volatile by itself. My bottle of "MC" was 100% methylene chloride, and small - it was half full in an old Tenax bottle. I got it from the lab at work. Very potent, but I only used it three/four times and, after several years, it had all escaped. I'll not get any more as you are correct - it's not the best stuff to keep around. Repeated significant exposure to volatiles like MC will do bad things to your system - the liver among other organs. Xylene is another - old Floquil used mixed xylenes as a solvent base. I had a friend, a GM&O fan, who painted a lot of railroad stuff for others. He passed away from cancer about ten years ago. I don't know for sure, but I have to believe his constant airbrush use was part of the problem. I rarely spray Floquil or other solvent based paints any more. Ken
Howdy folks, I'll kick in here and list what I use: ABS, plastic: Methyl Ethyl Ketone (MEK) available by the quart at hardware stores. Here is the MSDS info on it: http://www.chemical.net/cn_store/msds/Celanese/Methyl%20Ethyl%20Ketone.pdf. I used to use Ambroid and Tenax, but they are expensive and this stuff is cheap. I use it to clean airbrushes, too. Windows, wood: Canopy glue: Pacer 560. I love this stuff. It dries quickly and is impervious to alcohol used in washes. Hydrocal, plaster: 2 part epoxy. I found this works better than anything. Wood glue expands and leaves gaps in the castings. I never fill the gap, just glue wood bracing across the gap. Metal to metal: ACC Well, that's about it. Happy rails, mike
Gluing track to topper tape or to roadbed: DAP Dynaflex 230 #18305 Clear - Dries clear, will hold track in place but can be separated for those inherent model railroader track plan changes. Lay a 1/8" - 3/16" bead flattened with a serrated edge putty knife down the centerline where track is to be laid. Lay track, weight down for about an hour. This is so good I listed it twice! LOL
Guys, Be careful if you use M.E.K. (Methyl Ethyl Ketone) while it is a good substitute for Ambroid and Tenax, the stuff should only be used with adequate ventilation, or at least while wearing a paint respirator because of the toxic fumes. Also, it is HIGHLY flammable so don't use near any open flame. Tenax and Ambriod are toxic too because of the ingredients used, Methyl Ethyl Chlorine, which attacks the liver, kidneys, and central nervous system, and will cause CANCER if inhaled over long periods. The bottom line is any glue used for styrene is not good to be inhaled or spilled on your skin. George
I need a general purpose glue for plastics. I have just completely used out my stored supply of Testors model glue. Wal-mart used to have it in the model car aisle until about 2 years ago when all that stuff was removed. I have seen it at Hobby Lobby, but it was three times the old price for such a tiny bottle. I hope someone could help. Ship it on the Frisco!!! Murphy Millican
Here's what I use: (I'm 14, so I make it as cheap as I can get) Plastic to plastic: Testors, I don't know the # of it, it's clear and it's got a water viscosity. Flex track to play wood (I don't use road bed): Rose Art white glue for school projects. I use it all the time for track. It works good. It will firmly hold track in place, yet it doesn't tear it up when I remove it. And there is a price difference between Elmer's and Rose Art, 5c. 4oz bottle of Rose Art at walmart is 25c. Also for when the Testors i mentioned above doesn't work, i use Doit Best glue all, it dries clear and strong. Well, there's my 2c
Murphy, If you go to the website www.scalehobbyist.com they have Testors Liquid model glue for $2.39 a bottle. They also have a wide selection of Zap-a-Gap. Just click on "Paint and Construction" from the main menu. George
Murphy, back to my beginning post - Ambroid Pro Weld or since that is no longer available; Micro Mark Same Stuff.
Thanks for the replies. I'll try to make it to a hobbyshop when the snow melts. Has anyone been to the new hobby shop on Garrison avenue in Ft. Smith yet? I'm gonna try to check it out this month some time. Ship it on the Frisco!!! Murphy Millican
I had good luck with the Pro Weld also, but my hobby shop stopped selling it. I went with Tamiya Extra Thin Cement which has worked well for me. The Tamiya is slower to set up than the Pro Weld, but since I drop the small parts a lot , it actually works out because the hole is still able to take the part, whereas, the Pro Weld was so quick that I would have to put more cement in the hole. I have to hold some of the larger parts for about 30 seconds with the Tamiya, but I haven't found that too tiring . I wish I could find the Pro Weld again locally, as I did like that it sets up quicker than the Tamiya and would use it also. Anyway, I am happy with both.
The best CCA glue is made by Bob Smith Industries, do a google search, and available in most good hobby shops. What makes it so good is the varity he has and the fact that he does not make it until you order it. Hands down best styrene glue, bonder, is Tenax-7R!. You can bond Styrene to styrene through model paint, no other glue will do that that I have found. MEK, which is what Testers Liquid Cement is, is not as good as As Tenax-7R, Pro Weld, or Same Stuff from Micro Mark, all three are Methylene Choride in various strengths. One really good use for MEK is to make your own styrene putty. Get a old model paint bottle (glass) and fill it half way up with MEK; now add your scraps of styrene and you end up with styrene putty. Use this to fill any gaps, etc. on styrene projects. It will not shrink like Squardron Green, and since it is styrene it makes a prefect patch that you can sand, paint, etc. I also like Bob Smith Industries five minute epoxy, and when all else fails cyano-epoxy. Richard
I agree with Richard - Tenax-7R is the best styrene bonder I have ever used - fast, fast, fast! It is available again after being out of stock for a while. I believe it has a bit of methylene chloride in it, so: 1) Work fast because it doesn't stay around very long, 2) Don't take any deep breaths of it (no panting over your model!), 3) Keep the bottle cap on tight. I apply it with an old drafting ink pen. Ambroid Pro-Weld is also good - but is a tad slower, which sometimes comes in handy. I've tried a few others, and don't like any of them. Another thing I've tried, which works pretty well, is straight acetone, which you can get from a hardware store. Obviously, keep all of these away from open flame when you are working. (*) Ken (*) Back in my MSM days, in an organic chemistry lab, a guy was refluxing something in acetone as part of his experiment. He stepped back and lit up a smoke. His entire experiment blew up - miracle nobody was hurt by the flying glass.
Epoxy Glue Tips Needed... Anyone have suggestions for a good brand/type of epoxy? I've been using "Super Glue" brand of epoxy gel and haven't been having very good luck with it. After a couple of (Very minute) uses, the container becomes very hard to work with. The tip/cap becomes stuck and has to be removed with pliers and the glue and hardner both have to be gouged out of the tube with toothpicks. I usually have to throw away the rest of the container after using only a few pinhead size drops. Is there another brand or form of epoxy that would "keep" better? Any ideas?? Thanks, Tom G. PS: I use epoxy to glue different kinds of surfaces together. Metal to plastic, porous to non-porous etc. And surfaces that need to be flexible. I prefer it to "Super Glue" (Cyanaocrylate) which seems less flexible.
Re: Epoxy Glue Tips Needed... Hi Tom, You should be able to pick up separate bottles of the epoxy and hardener (I get mine from the local hobby store that specializes in RC aircraft). Having separate bottles ensures that the harder does not mix with the epoxy, thus allowing it to last a very long time. Brand isn't an issue.
Re: Epoxy Glue Tips Needed... When I need something heavy, I use this stuff made by DOIT BEST called super cement. It is a liquid at first, but after a few minutes it becomes tacky and then it becomes hard, but has a little bit of flexibility to it. I haven't had any problems wit the tip plugging. But the glue does tend to get on the side on the nozzle and make it hard to open the cap. You can probably find it at your local hardware store. That's were I get mine. Just be careful you open the flap that tells you the info about the glue, and make sure the color is cristal clear. Some of the tubes have amber color cement. Ethan
Tom, I moved your question and the discussion to this thread because it belongs here. Take a look through previous posts to see if something fits your need.
Tom - One tip regarding keeping any brand of "super glue" useable for a long time is to keep it in a refrigerator. Keeping it cool when not in use extends its life significantly. My two bottles (thin and thick) are about five years old now, still effective. After use, I run a steel pin down the spout of the bottle, and then wipe the surface of the spout tip off. This helps keep the glue from building up on and in the tip. Acetone, available at hardware stores, is a solvent for most if not all of the super glues, so you could also use that to clean the bottle tip. Be careful, acetone is volatile and goes "boom" if it sees a flame. Try not to get it on your fingers, as it removes skin oils quickly, and try not to breathe the vapor. Acetone is a good organic solvent - that's why it is in hardware stores, but be careful with it. Ken
