Athearn HO Scale Generic 4-4-0 Steam Locomotive

And here I am thinking about getting ride of the few diesel I have. I never run them...I try to like them and they are what I grow up with. But there just boring to me. It may just be me. When I was a kid the neatest loco to me was the Frisco 1526 at the Lawton museum, Not the Frisco diesel working around the city. I saw those every day, way would I model them?

I really think it is hard to sale generic steam in HO anymore with the trend to Proto steam locomotives models. There are a lot of new steam locos available, if you model one of the popular roads. This has lead to rethink what roads I am going to model? Look at BLI UP and PRR model selections. My first real HO loco was a MDC PRR 4-4-2 (still have it). So I pricked up one of the BLI PRR 4-4-2 they release a few years ago. Real neat model. So I got off the PRR 0-6-0s they just released. This is best running switcher in my collection.

I guess am in the "I'm into model railroading for the steam locos" group. Of course if I had the free capital I would be modeling 7.5" live steam.

 

I could have written that post.

I actually have a number of diesels. When I got back into modeling about 20 years ago, I always intended to model a steam era evocation of the old Missouri Pacific branch back home. But other than a few scattered memories of steam on it when I was very young, my exposure to it was the GP7/Alco S-1 era. I bought those models, bought a blue/grey F7 set, and some black widow T&NO Engines for the T&NO interchange. But none of them have ever set a wheel on my rail other than a couple of feet in the yard to see if they ran when I first bought them. I’ll never sell them, I hold them in reserve in case I ever feel like more closely modeling the home town. But as I approach the big 8-Oh, that’s getting less than less and less likely.

I saw steam in the last couple of years it ran in my town. Even as a very little kid, those memories are burned deep into my mind and will never let go.

Gotta get back to the layout right now. A Mopac 2-10-0 is calling my name.

 

What caused me to take pause in regards to modeling HO steam within the 19th century era of my interest were several fold:

* Painting the engines into liveries appropriate to their era.

* Suitable rolling stock in readily available form. (Kits or otherwise.)

* Installing sound in the minuscule tenders.

* The practical need to use knuckle couplers instead of the more correct link and pin.

I also foresaw issues with trying to create appropriate looking scenes as well as issues with painting the backdrops.

In all, I ultimately chickened-out and went back to diesels because diesels were the stays of my youth, much easier to obtain nice performing examples in model form, easier to paint/weather, etc.

HOWEVER... I do still do link n' pin modeling... but I do it in V scale ("Virtual" scale, i.e. computer simulation.) Below is a view of the simplistic engine facilities that existed on the Frisco's 18 mile "Mansfield Branch" in the 1880s at "Hackett City". (Now called simply "Hackett" and devoid of rails for the past 30 years.)


Andre

 

I model 20s though 40s. But I have a though about doing one early 1900s freelance railroad to service mines and a couple of towns and camps in South West Oklahoma. At the scale and gauge do I go with... HO, HOn3 or On3...

What I find interesting is when talking to other modelers they say how they like the performance and reliable of there HO diesel models compared to steam models. I have had the complete opposite experiences with ones I have. But I have to look at what I have to comparing. I only have and handful, 6 Athearns and 1 Rapido. (2 Genesis GP7s, SW1500 last run, 1 BB GP38-2, 1 BB SW1500, and the U25B). These are being competing to BLI steamers like an old Power House 2-8-2, Par3 2-8-0, Par4 Commodore Vanderbilt, Par4 ATFS 3640, Par4 4-4-2, Par4 0-6-0, Par4 6-8-6 (this may be a favorite model) and a Par3 2-8-8-2 (I only own 2 locos that can out pull this model and those two are is a completely different category of models and they would need there own tread to go over them). Then I have a few Athearn 2-6-0s and a 2-8-0, 16 or 17 Bachmann and 2 IHC and my old MDC kits. So if compared to the MDC kits my diesel are way way better. and they pull better then half my Bachmanns, but the Bachmanns have better pickups. The new SW1500 stalls on turnouts when running it at switching speeds on the big layout. So I do most my switching with an Athearn 2-6-0, very good power pickups and pulling power for a small model. I know, I could power my frogs, but that's a lot of work and it's easier to just have a model with 14 wheels picking up power.

But I was realty hoping to add a couple of those Athearn 4-4-0s to my steam roster. They would have fit right in with the 2-10-0s and 2-8-0s.

 

I never understand what people are talking about saying that HO scale diesels Are easier to maintain than steam locomotives. I have about 35 steam locomotives and have never had any real problems with any of them. What could possibly go wrong on a model steam locomotive that wouldn’t go wrong with a diesel?

 

Both have a DC motor turning gears turning wheels.

Was think about something. I wonder how much the model railroad industry is being harmed by the pre-order/just in time style of manufacturing? There have been several cars that I did not per-order because I did not need them at the time. but a 6 months later I needed one or four. Not that long ago I would have just made a trip to one of the hobby shops and picketed up the cars I needed, usually in kit form. Now days I can't get hardly get any rolling stock I need. Have to wait for a rerun and they may of may not do the road you need. Thinking about being someone new to the hobby and able to get rolling stock to pull behind your new loco.

My other hobby (Warhammer), Is not plagued with this issue. The models for all there armies are usually in stock and if not, just click the notify me when available button.

This is good for my wallet, I am not buy cars ever week any more.

 

This whole limited run thing has driven me crazy too. I’ve been ended up getting stuff, trying to project what might be my future need, And then not using them. For example, I bought every road number I could have of every steel Missouri Pacific and TP boxcar that came out, Southern Pacific too since I interchange with them. And then what happens? I backdated my railroad to 1935 when wood cars predominated. And those steel cars have sat unused since then. I also bought all six road numbers of PFE and ART reefers for sentimental reasons because if I didn’t buy them then, I wouldn’t get to buy them at all, then came to my senses and realized that my branchline doesn’t have any customers that need reefers. I bought all six road numbers of several runs of UTLX Tank cars, thinking of running an oil train, and then, realizing that three or four would probably suited my branch perfectly well. It’s just not the days of the Jurassic anymore when once Athearn brought out a road name, it stayed in the catalog for years. You have to buy it when it’s there for a fleeting moment, or even pre-order it if you want to get it at all, but your requirements may change before you get the cars at all.

Then there’s the other side of the coin, like our Frisco 4-4-0, where you have to sign up to pre-order something that you really want, then find out that less than 90 people in the world (Intermountain’s minimum) want it, and it never gets as far as production.

Thank God for eBay, that’s where I’ve gotten almost all my stuff in the last several years.

 

Valve gear binds.
Gear lash issues
Driver(s) out of quarter
Driver alignment issues.
Finicky electrical pick-up.
Cross head binds.
Lead/trailing truck tracking issues.
Tender/Engine electrical connections/wires.
Driver tracking issues.
Etc.

Andre

 

"Finicky electrical pick-up" My new SW1500 defiantly suffers from this. And there is no room for a Cap Pack to help it out. It is one crammed full loco. The Athearn 2-6-0 tenders have more free space in them.

I think all the diesel I own have a pair of U-joints in them. Usually twice the internal moving parts. But I think all the modern diesel models have a similar drive train as the articulated steam models Motor driving 2 U-joints on drive shafts to two gear towers that drive the wheel axles.

Most of may steam loco model issues have been internal parts, Split gears, motor failures, U-joints failures, wheel wiper issues. Knock on wood, but I have only had two running gear issues.

But I also do not own any of the Bachmann train set level or old Tyco steam locos, These are just plagued with issues. If this is someone experiences with HO steam I can under stand way they would what nothing to do with steam models. like Bachamanns 0-6-0 train set/ basic model, it only has pickups on the 6 drives, plastic draw bar with peg to for a loco connection. Other then a oval these are going to have issues.

My worst running locos in order: Blue Box SW1500, MDC 0-6-0 (it never ran great), Blue Box SD45-2, Latest Ath SW1500, MDC 4-4-2 (it's just old), Old RIV 2-8-8-2. The rest all run good, we get into who pulls better, who can handle the branch line, etc.

Something else to think about is cost. I love my steam locos...they are just so cool looking when they are running. But you can buy 2 to 3 Athearn Genesis diesels to one BLI steam loco. $150 steam loco is just that. Go compare the parts diagram of a Bachmann to a BLI and you will see why the BLI is $450 and up. And a BLI paired with a TSU-2 is very good running loco.

 

Tenwheeler...

As for my observations about model steam: Been there done that. Built my first MDC kit in '76. Have had many since. Still have MDC kits, both built and those not built. I also have RTR steam from MDC, Athearn Genesis, etc. As for my steam models: Some I have re-powered them, some had to be modified, I've chased valve binds, etc, etc. Sometimes getting a steam model to run acceptably well has been like getting wisdom teeth pulled.

Thus, my steam experiences have been far more piddle-some than ANY of my diesel excursions both past and present. Within the past few years, the ONLY diesels that I've had to put time into the mechanisms are some old P2K's that I simply wasn't happy with their performance, so I modified the frames to receive Kato motor/flywheels and trucks. Essentially a Kato when finished. End of problem. All of my other diesel purchases, whether newer Bachmann, Atlas/China, Genesis, whatever, run and perform great with no fiddling. I have upwards of 30 diesel engines currently in service and more in the pipeline. All run great and do not need wheel cleaning that often. The only ones that need it more often are a pair of old Atlas Yellow Box RS-3's I have been in service since the mid-1990s or longer. From that batch, I have 6 other diesels that are contemporary with the RS-3's, however, only the RS-3's have literally run the nickle plating off their wheels and are now worn down to the brass. Because of that, they need their wheels cleaned more often than any of the other diesels. BUT, they still run just as smooth as ever and have will run for the rest of my remaining years.

As for your woes with your older Athearn SW's: Those sintered wheels Athearn loved were notorious for oxidizing and had to be cleaned often, but far less often than brass wheels such as seen on many MDC steam products.

So, can't say why you've had bad luck with your diesels vs steam, but for me it has been totally opposite.

Andre

 

If you like steam, Then steam it is.
If you like diesels, Then diesels it is.
If you like both, Then both it is.

Problem solved.

Now what I find interesting to read about how the problems of each motive power problems are resolved . This is good info for all of us to absorb and can relate to.
Is this a great hobby or what?
I think it is.

John

 

Yup. Let your passion be in the drivers seat.

IF you love and have passion for it, you'll find a way to make it work for you.

As for me, my passion for model railroading has been flat lined for several months now. However, as a nigh life long model railroader, I'm hoping to see some blips on the heart monitor "soon".

Andre

 

Andre,
Hope to see those Blips turn into a strong steady beat.
Really miss seeing the progress posted about your layout and the anticipation of not seeing anything posted lately is a bummer.

John

 

Thanks John.

Right now, the blips are to further my interior KCMO theme L-shaped switching layout that I want to have for days such as today: Cold, rainy/sleet, There are days during the winter when it's just not a good day to be traipsing to/from the layout building. Plus, at night (when going to/from the layout building is more treacherous as we continue to age) an interior layout will be a place I can piddle with trains at night.

 

I do full agree with this. Trying to get old N scale Atlas/Rivarossi 4-6-2 and 2-8-2 running. And the N scale Model Power 2-8-2. This locos are a nightmare to keep running.

I not sure 2 would be considered bad luck. Funny that both are SW1500s. But ones old and the other I think has truck pickup issue. And if I was to get another one it more them likely not have the issue. I do like the working strobe and beacon lights and it has a group light which is cool. And both my Athearn GP7s work flawlessly.

There is another diesel model advantage... you can pick them without breaking off or bending parts. Except for my Rapido U25b...every time i pick it up something little part fails off.

I fully agree with Geep07... Model what ever is your "cup of tea"

Now something new and cool is the Tru-Fans feature on the Class One Model Works GP40s. This is neat stuff!

Oh, I am surprised no one was curious about the locos I have that can out pull a BLI 2-8-8-2? The BLI 2-8-8-2 can pull real brick loads.

 

Well said. I buy trains because I like them, not because of sale price or comparison of maintenance issues. if you like it, you’re going to get it, end of thought.

I’ve had all of those issues happen to my steam engines, but you know what, I learned to fix them and I don’t mind doing it. Someone who buys diesels over steam engines because of the potential maintenance did not live with the early days of modeling where you had to make everything yourself and fix everything yourself.

 

The only steam engines I have had operational issues out of the box were my first Bachmann decapods 15 years ago . It took a while to find out that it wasn’t the engine’s fault, It was Bachmann selling them with a very poorly pre-programmed DCC decoder. Once I learned how to manipulate the motor control CVs, Those babies would smoothly crawl like ants, like all the rest of my steam engines, mostly Bachmann spectrum but A few BLI ones in there too. But Bachmann should’ve set those decapods correctly set to begin with, there’s no telling how many of those beautiful engines ended up in the trash because they ran so poorly right out of the box.

I own several diesels that I bought as a hedge against maybe one day wanting to model my hometown the way I saw it in the early 1960s. But no diesel has yet ever polished my rail, and I can’t bring myself to do it at this time.

 

Not necessarily.

I started my HO model railroad journey Christmas of 1962 at the age of 10 years old. Before we moved from that house sometime in 1963, I had already built my first "layout", including starting to dabble in scratch building structures. In 1966 or so, I built my second layout: A 12' x 8' L-shaped w/open grid bench work. I also built my first Quality Craft kits (auto racks and Hy-Cube boxcars). I modeled what I saw in the railroad world at the time.

Modeling what I saw was my way to model until the F's disappeared off my favorite railroad: The Frisco. (I was modeling the Frisco at the time.) From that point on, as a general rule, my diesel modeling included Geeps and F's. Over the decades I have performed extensive modifications to models to make them more accurate, as well as numerous re-power projects, even commissioned custom modifications/paint/decal/weathering work, as well as some commissioned re-power work.

Seeing as there are no diesels for my chosen theme that are "RTR", I either have to work from the ground up with an undecorated unit, or worse, strip the paint of a desired model, and then go to work making it what I want.

Steam came into the picture for me after The Experience I received in 1976 on a cold blustery night standing on an overpass near Ramona, OK. I was standing there to watch the Freedom Train approach from the distance, pass under me, and pass into the night. From that point on until recently, I also built steam engines and rolling stock with the hope that "someday" I would also have a steam powered layout. I even worked running steam engines for a while. (As an extra man in the late 1980s on the Eureka Springs & North Arkansas.)

Over the decades, I have built a total of about 8 personal layouts plus some custom layouts for others (some in HO and some in 3-rail), even a commissioned layout for a commercial endeavor (G scale).

So, yes, I lived the early days of modeling, and to this day I still have to modify/paint/decal/weather my own stuff, even re-power as necessary, both for myself, and commissioned to do so for others at times.

In my case, I eventually had to make a choice, for I don't have the years left to continue with with the intention of having a layout for both. My experiences aboard diesels and my career in railroading heavily influenced my decision to go strictly with diesels. Plus, I wanted to model a moderately busy north/south through line in the Arkansas Ozarks during the era of my youth. Such a theme would require well over two dozen locomotives, either steam or diesel. The logistics alone also tipped the scales in favor of diesels. (I currently have over 30 engines DCC/Sound equipped and in service, and more in the pipeline.)

So, when it comes to fixing things and making things myself, I think I have adequate experience in that realm. I made the choice to model what I model, not because of the ease of RTR, but because what I have chosen to model touches base with my experiences in 1:1 railroading over the decades.

We all have to find our happy place in model railroading. I think I've found mine, and it reads as if some of you have also found yours.

It's all good.

Andre

 

Nice reply, Andre.

I have to say, though, some of the most exciting days in Model railroading for me were a very long time ago when I didn’t know anything about being prototypical or maybe trying to model a certain railroad accurately. I just bought stuff because I liked it, and ran it. My mantua mikado was the stuff of dreams on my 4x8. Along with the Varney Casey Jones that came not long after.

And in those early 1960s days of the Jurassic, there were prototypes worth going down to look at. F units, high nose Geeps, Alco S-1’s, wood cabooses, kerosene lanterns on cabooses and switch stands , a friendly towerman who let us up in the tower ……. All accessible by bicycle in the hot humid summer air. We stood under those low hanging green copper wires along the track zinging in the wind. We breathed the drifting intoxicating Railroad perfume, a heady mixture of creosote, diesel, and musty old 75-year-old wood railroad buildings.

Those were the days, my friend, we thought they’d never end. But they did.

 

@patrick flory

Oh yes, my "Wonder Years" with model railroading were so much fun. Ignorance truly is bliss. I didn't have a clue concerning the discrepancies in the Athearn GP7/9 or their F7's, etc, they looked good to my young eyes, and I had a ton of fun with them.

With knowledge can come the desire for more sophistication, and more sophistication can bring with it more exacting and tedious work. I do love the detail, the performance, love the sounds, and love the flexibility of DCC found in my current models... but my Wonder Years contain many wonderful memories as I "grew into" the hobby.

I wouldn't take anything for my current models, but I also wouldn't have changed a thing in regards to my learning and growing years with HO scale.

Some of us are just meant to be model railroaders.

Andre