Announced: Broadway Limited E8 Units

Discussion in 'N Scale' started by Larry E Shankles, Mar 15, 2014.

  1. meteor910

    meteor910 2009 Engineer of the Year Staff Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Why in the world does BLI have this fetish to produce E8's that have already been done by Proto 2000? My goodness, there were 17 of them, and P2K only did four! Pick a couple of the others and they might sell a few.

    K
     
  2. gjslsffan

    gjslsffan Staff Member Staff Member

    It does kinda defy logic huh? Wonder what the end game could be....
     
  3. pbender

    pbender Member Frisco.org Supporter

    As mentioned earlier in this thread, we tried to get the numbers changed, but apparently BLI didn't listen.

    It seems as though BLI decided that it had been long enough since the Life-Like models were produced that they were not common on the market any longer.

    Paul
     
  4. TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020)

    TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020) Passed Away July 15, 2020 Frisco.org Supporter

    Now they can get down to business and produce some more of those highly sought after Santa Fe warbonnets and not be troubled anymore by those annoying Frisco geeks...

    TG
     
  5. meteor910

    meteor910 2009 Engineer of the Year Staff Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Paul -
    The logic of BLI's thinking is obviously lost on me. If I have already purchased a 2016 or a 2019 from P2K, and I am happy with them (I am), why would I want to purchase another 2016 or 2019 from BLI no matter how much time has passed since I've had the P2K's?

    I wonder if they are doing this so they have guidance from the P2K units on the lettering and number fonts? (But they would also have a good reference on many other names and numbers from the Herald King and/or Microscale decal sets.)

    Beats me! All I know is that I don't have any need for another 2016, 2019, 2020 or 2022 from BLI. (FYI, I changed the name on 2022 to Champion using the Herald King set).

    Ken
     
  6. pbender

    pbender Member Frisco.org Supporter

    If you're happy with them, then there isn't a reason to buy another.

    There are three considerations I am aware of however:
    1) There are a lot of N-scalers who complain about the shape of the nose on the Life-Like E units. I'm not enough of a rivet counter to notice that, but some are.
    2) Sound. N-scale doesn't have the plethora of RTR sound equiped units that HO has, and adding speakers to split framed locomotives usually requires frame milling.
    3) DCC. The n-scale plastic framed Life-Like E units are pretty easy to make room for a decoder, but that requires a hard wired decoder and loosing a weight (or you mill the weight out, which takes tools ( see: http://n-scale-dcc.blogspot.com/2011/12/dz123-in-older-life-like-e8.html )). The split fame version also takes a hard wired decoder and some frame milling (see: http://www.tcsdcc.com/Customer_Cont...Scale/Life_Like/E8A/N_LL_E8A_plastic_M-1.html ). Many N-scalers don't have the tools to do the soldering work required on either of these units.

    Paul
     
  7. tmfrisco

    tmfrisco Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Lest I show my ignorance:(, oh well, it wouldn't be the first time, so here goes: I am wondering if these BLI units are N gauge or HO gauge? I see this is in the N gauge forum, but I read posts that seem to be referring to HO, thus my confusion:confused:. I guess the answer depends on whether P2K produced both N and HO E8s. If they produced N gauge units, then I can truly say that I learned something today:). Terry
     
  8. TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020)

    TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020) Passed Away July 15, 2020 Frisco.org Supporter

    I think this particular chat is referring to N scale.

    Tom G.
     
  9. pbender

    pbender Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Yes, Life Like produced E8s in Frisco paint in both N and HO.

    And this thread is referring to the N-Scale BLI E8s

    BTW, my replacement shell arrived today from BLI and it does have the right name and number.

    Paul
     
  10. tmfrisco

    tmfrisco Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Thanks for the info. I have never seen a P2K N scale very interesting.

    Terry
     
  11. meteor910

    meteor910 2009 Engineer of the Year Staff Member Frisco.org Supporter

    At the considerable risk of wearing out this topic, that is not my point. I am thinking from the producer's perspective, not my perspective as a buyer. Why would BLI expect anyone who has any of the four P2K Frisco E8's (you, me and many, many others probably as they made and sold a ton of them, HO and N) to buy additional units that are the same number and horse name? What logic is there in the producer's thinking to make only numbered and named Frisco units that have already been done? There are twelve other E8 names/numbers to pick from, including several favorite units!

    For example, when Kadee announces another Frisco PS-1 boxcar that is identical to others in the series they have already released, they do a new number, not more of a previous number. That generally results in Frisco crazed folks like me buying one of the new numbered PS-1's. Crazed as I am, I have no intention of ever buying a BLI Frisco E8 numbered 2016, 2019, 2020, or 2022 unless there is something that makes them a vast improvement over the P2K's, of which I have five (I also have 2006 in the ugly austerity scheme).

    K
     
  12. TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020)

    TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020) Passed Away July 15, 2020 Frisco.org Supporter

    My two cents on this is why does a manufacturer, when they're going to the trouble to produce a model, with all the tool and die problems, factory liaison details, importing and shipping arrangements, marketing, etc. etc, etc., why wouldn't they want to just GET IT RIGHT!!?? Ten minutes of research in a Marre or Collias book or an email to this website and none of this would even raised a blip on the model railroad radar...

    Tom G.
     
  13. pbender

    pbender Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Tom,

    In the case of the name on the 2016 model I received, I think this was a case of not catching an error in the final production run. The pre-production artwork had the right name and number on it, it was the factory that didn't get it right.

    A sample size of 1 is too small to know if this was a simple manufacturing error, resulting in a few units with the wrong name, or if there was a problem with the whole run.

    Paul
     
  14. pbender

    pbender Member Frisco.org Supporter

    I'm not trying to get into the manufacturers head, but the argument is a slippery slope argument that if you take that to the logical conclusion means you are arguing that no manufacturer should EVER reproduce a model of something that was ever produced before. For a manufacturer, that argument severely limits what you can produce, so you have to weigh the age of the previous incarnations of the model with advances in technology, and buyer expectations.

    Speaking for the n-scale models, the Life-Like E8s were middle of the line tooling even when they were produced in the 1990s. The Kato tooling from the same time period was much better, but also significantly more expensive. The BLI units are real gems compared to either the Life-Like or Kato units, especially considering the factory applied etched grills, grab irons, and operating diaphragms, not to mention all of the electronic advances.

    Having all three of the above in Frisco paint (including three Kato units that are custom painted, two in Orange and White...) I can't run the Life-Like units with the Kato or BLI units. The Kato Units are OK to run with the BLI ones, but I probably wouldn't photograph them together.

    If you want, I can take photos of all three incarnations to show you the differences.

    Paul
     
  15. TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020)

    TAG1014 (Tom Galbraith RIP 7/15/2020) Passed Away July 15, 2020 Frisco.org Supporter

    Well if they propose to produce a true to prototype model, they need to be held to a higher standard. Different from say a Walthers Penn Central steam locomotive or a Lionel FA Texas Special engine which everyone knew weren't prototypical and weren't really fooling anyone...

    Tom G.
     
  16. meteor910

    meteor910 2009 Engineer of the Year Staff Member Frisco.org Supporter

    Sigh!

    If I mis-spoke about N-scale models, sorry about that. I'm not an N-scaler. In HO, the P2K Frisco models are darn good, even with their running gear troubles (the second release). They look terrific.

    K
     

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