Of all the photographs of SD45s I have come across I have never seen more than two running together. Was there some sort of rule limiting the number of six axle locomotives on any one train? April
The SD45s had territorial restrictions as well operational restrictions. From a 1967 Employee Time Table (ETT). Weight and truck wheelbase was a factor, but the combined tractive effort produced by electric traction motors also was a factor.
Not be very likely, the amount of traffic on that subdivision most likely would not have justified that much power.
I will second what Keith said, not very likely. And to point a specific on the picture Karl posted, the time table only states Carl Junction - Joplin as allowed, which is the Tuckahoe Branch. This would exclude the Joplin Branch, Galena Branch and what was left of the Carterville Branch. Joplin did not handle any through traffic for the Frisco by this time. There just would not be a need for the SD45s, or any of the other high horsepower locomotives, on this line. Specific information and pictures from the area are scarce, but I have only seen GP's in Joplin. I would assume that they were replaced by GP38-2s when the last of the GP7s were retired.
Let us remember that during 1967, only the first batch of SD45s had arrived, and the Frisco had yet to realize the the impact that their use implied. Things on the railroad are dynamic, so let us take a look at a later Employee Time Table (ETT) from 1975. The Frisco experienced derailments with the new units as described by Lloyd Hobbs, the Southwestern Division, Division Engineer: "The SD45 were giving me fits on the Chickasaw Subdivision. Had two derailments both on curves at about the SC points (spiral to curve). I got to both derailments first so nobody had a chance to see where the train ran off the track first. At the SC point it looked like something hit the high rail so as to turn the high rail out. Next thing I saw was a flange mark running on the web of the forcing wide gauge and yet the engines were sitting on top of the rail. I talked to several people about this. I felt like maybe the third axle wheel was the problem that it was hitting the high rail turning it out which led to derailment but they were a strong powerful engine. Two of those according to J P Knox, Mechanical Officer, would take the place of three other engines. I do not remember any other SD45 on the Chickasha Subdivision.” My Dad, Charles Brand, was Roadmaster on the Kansas City Subdivision at this time, and he was instructed to rattle-spike curves of 2-1/2 degrees and greater which alleviated the problem. On subdivisions where this measure was too expensive, the Frisco banned the units. The six-axle restriction also applied to foreign road units, which were used on run-through service. One Saturday, my brother and I were assisting my dad survey one of the new industrial tracks in Lenexa, KS. FSE came to a stop at "Cross-Over C”. FSE left town with 4, Union Pacific (UP) 6 axle units in the consist. My dad had his pack set, and we could hear the crew and dispatcher conversing about the need to set-out the rear unit. Once the offending unit was removed, FSE headed south. http://www.frisco.org/shipit/index.php?threads/new-product-sd45.2817/page-2#post-17721
I am still looking for an image of 3 Frisco SD45s on a train. I have seen at least one, but not in the Frisco archives. In later years the SD45s were seen in consists of 3. They were hard on the rail as has been indicated on these earlier posts. The SD45s were main line heavy traffic locomotives. It was their horse power per powered axle, that made them shine. They did demand good track structure and maintenance. The Southern Pacific (SP) and Denver and Rio Grand Western (DRGW) had many SD45s that were used in 10 degree curves. They were heavy at 368,000 pounds, so not friendly to light rail. They would flat boogie with a train, but they were rough riding locomotives. No shock absorbers, rode like you were on a pogo stick. I was on a few, over some rough switches at 50-60 mph, and swore we hit the plow on the track and felt the journal boxes hit the pedestal straps. This all went away when the unit was in power or braking, meaning the journal boxes would be pressed to the pedestal liners, providing dampening of sorts. But there was nothing like being on these locomotives, feeling as well as hearing those 20 cylinder EMDs go to work, you knew you were on something very powerful. No micro-processors, no cameras, just power, raw and pure.
Great info guys, thanks Karl your memory is stunning. You are a fountain of knowledge. Tom, I always enjoy stories from guys like you, Bill, Andre, etc. Real railroaders.
I am probably going to get skewered for this, but I have a recollection of reading somewhere that Frisco ordinarily added a four-axle unit to a pair of SD45s to maximize tractive effort The thinking being that three of the big beasts was too much horsepower. Lou Marre suggests as much on page 118 of Frisco in Color, authored by Lou and Greg Sommers. Photographs that I have seen in various publications, including my own Frisco Power in Color, regularly show a pair of SD45s assisted by a F7B, a GP38AC, a GP38-2, a GP40-2 or a four-axle GE unit. In any event, I have never seen a photograph of a Frisco power set that included more than two SD45s. However, this does not mean that there never was one. GS
I knew in the back of my mind that as time went on, they relaxed the restrictions, I just needed to find the pictures of it. I found two pictures from 1980 in Tulsa. The first is of 3 SD45s lashed together with no 4 axle power to separate the units. http://frisco.org/mainline/wp-conte...-Tulsa-Oklahoma-on-July-14-1980-Gene-Gant.jpg This was always allowed, but maybe not commonly practiced? The second picture is a set of 3 6 axle units, SD40-2 and 2 SD45s),with a GP40-2 to split the SD45s, which was not originally allowed. http://frisco.org/mainline/wp-conte...0-2-956-at-Tulsa-Oklahoma-in-October-1980.jpg
I have read somewhere in this forum that the engineers have dubbed the SD45s as Cadillacs. Reasoning?
First time I saw that term applied to a locomotive was Southern Pacific's SD9s or maybe SD7s. I am too old to remember which. GS
I recall seeing several Frisco freights with SD45-GP35-GP35-SD45 lash ups at the Geyer/Big Bend grade crossing They were on the Rolla Subdivision in St. Louis County. Those were the days! K
On Ken Fitzgerald's website (www.fl9.com), there is a picture of 3 Frisco SD45s in the same consist at Dacoma, OK. Pease see the following. https://secureservercdn.net/45.40.1...LSF_923_West_Train_QLA_Dacoma_OK_07-24-80.jpg There is also a picture on Ken's website of 3 Frisco SD45s along with a Santa Fe SD45. Just after the merger, I remember seeing 2 Frisco SD45s and 2 BN SD45s on a train. I am assuming it was the old QLA headed westbound at Canyon, TX on the Santa Fe.
Here is the link to the second picture. https://secureservercdn.net/45.40.1...an-francisco/SLSF_955_Gerlach_OK_07-27-80.jpg For what its worth, Gerlach, OK is on the west side of Woodward, OK, which would be on the ATSF about 45 miles west of the Avard gateway. Assuming they still had to comply with the rules with the 6 axle units, one locomotive would have to be set out at Waynoka, OK.
